AuctionCUT - Auction and eBay Forum

AuctionMan · Power Member Joined: 01 Sep 2005 Posts: 168

Not my work but a thought provoking article (I've lost the author link but will add it when I find it):

There was a time, not too long ago, when you could post an auction on eBay and have a reasonable expectation that the person buying from you was a vetted member of the eBay community. Much more importantly, there was a time when you had a reasonable expectation that sending money to someone with a bunch of positive feedback was a good idea. You could reasonably expect to receive the merchandise within a reasonable period of time. And, for the most part, the goods would be more or less what you were expecting.

That was then.

Now, there seem to be three categories of vendors on eBay: full-time eBay merchants, normal people, and scum-sucking pigs. Feedback (wonderful, utopian concept that it is) is all but worthless. Hijacking someone's eBay account is child's play. PayPal offers no version of customer service and, truth be told, neither does eBay.

Of my 10 most recent transactions (all purchases), two were scams. And, I'm pretty good at spotting fraudulent auctions. These were sellers with 98 percent positive feedback, and the transactions were under $50 each. I paid via PayPal using buy-it-now and never received the goods. The PayPal system for handling such matters sucks and, as I said earlier, eBay's customer service is even worse. Just how much time will you spend filing and tracking rip-off artists through their pathetic reporting system? Everyone places a different value on their hard-earned money, so I suspect that the answers are as varied as the individuals involved.

That being said, do you have a reasonable expectation that the Mac G5 you are bidding on is going to be shipped to you? How about the Sony Plasma 60-inch monitor? Or, the Sony PSP for $50 to $100 over retail? No, you don't. Now, you might say, "Hey, moron! Why are you bidding on stuff like that on eBay? Don't you know that 95 percent of those auctions are fraudulent - especially the ones that only accept payment via Western Union?" Of course I know. But what about all of the people who don't?

My armchair research has the number of fraudulent auctions on eBay at about 25 percent and the number is growing fast. So the question is: How long can eBay sustain the platform-only business? At some point, using eBay is going to be as dangerous as downloading a file without virus-checking software.

Of course, sellers are having a pretty hard time of it too. Here's a quote from one of my favorite eBay/PayPal e-mails to sellers: "We regret to inform you that you received funds from an account with reports of fraudulent bank account use. In accordance with PayPal's Seller Protection Policy, the following transaction involving unauthorized funds has been reversed." Ouch! Sounds more like PayPal's screw-the-seller policy, than a seller protection policy to me.

Is eBay going to collapse under its own weight? Can something this big and this unregulated evolve into a healthy marketplace? I'd love to hear your thoughts and solutions.

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thxebay · Posted: Thu Aug 16, 2007 3:28 pm Post subject: ..

Highly doubt it. eBay is a giant, they have the right people in the right places. It's all the little companies that should worry.

thecountryowl · AuctionCUT Moderator Joined: 14 Mar 2007 Posts: 140

It always puzzles me how there seems to be the overwhelming majority of people who are happy with eBay, but every so often, someone comes along and writes an article like that.

I'm always thinking how I'd love to be a fly on the wall, and find out exactly what prompted such negative sentiment. Surely, it wasn't one bad experience. Most of the time, these people sound bitter. There has to be something to it.

stevew8975 · Posted: Sat Aug 18, 2007 6:39 pm Post subject:

I have to agree that although I still, and probably will for a long time, use eBay quite extensively, but I do feel that genuine sellers are having to put up with more and more obstacles that eBay place in their way.

The Seller performance policy where neutrals count against us, yet there is no arbitration available when unjust remarks are left. On one hand eBay say that feedback is entirely independent and subjective, yet on the other they use these comments as a stick to beat us with?

Buyer protection is only available when using Paypal, yet Seller protection will allow unverified buyers to purchase high value items.

Final Value Fees and Insertion Fees are credited when successfully winning an unpaid item dispute, but listing upgrades - featured, bold, subtitles etc, are not reimbursed?

Listings are only removed upon other member's say so, and without verification - it's easy to find fault with a competitors listing, report it, and watch it disappear.

eBay is not the friendly and cosy place it was many years ago, and it is clear to see that it has become a corporate giant and forgotten it's community roots. Having said that, as long as people are aware of the potential pitfalls and they keep themselves within the (extensive) policies, then eBay can not be ignored as an effective sales and marketing media.

It's just that could be sooo much better.

monkeymeg · Just Registered Joined: 30 Oct 2007 Posts: 2

There is actual research being done that supports that the spiral of Ebay going into a lemon marketplace. If you put a quick search of Ebay and a lemon market you will see quite a bit of information on this topic.

Once Ebay legally gets to stand behind a veil of section 230 of the Communications act and say they are just an ISP, no more no less then it did invite a concept of we can do anything we want to.

If you don't think the fraud numbers are going up as suggested then why did Ebay stop publishing this number numerous years ago. At that time the numbers were 1 in 40000 transactions being paid through insurance claims.

Now several years ago I did catch someone called lctrading. The account was hijacked. The telephone number listed was going to a hotel at big bear hotel in one of the storage areas. I found where the checks were being mailed. How the people were picking up the envelopes. Which bank they did their deposits at. A description of the person doing the deposit. In any event enough information to warn others that all the auctions which were in the mid six figures could be squished. No one was warned and I was given information that if I contacted others that I could be penalized.

In any event it doesnt take a genius to figure out that what the original writer is talking about true. Do a youtube search on ebay... My favorite is one where a person has over almost 60000 transactions for tvs and other items and is demonstrated that it is all fraud. "Ebay ownage"

Take a look at any item like a laptop and run through the ads. If you can't find a fraudulent listing in less than 20 minutes you shouldnt be buying from Ebay. On the flip side the honest people that are trying to sell a laptop. How many of these sellers are doing multiple attempts at selling these because they have been approached by a winning seller who is buying the item for their sick nephew or some other wild story.

I purchased a vehicle on Ebay and during that tenure I was more or less amazed at the level of fraud going on these big ticket items. It was astounding.

If you don't think Ebay is out of control you just havent tried to do any research.

I bid on these fraud transactions to make my point and as evidence of what I say is true. I dont bid on all of them because some of them also have phishing and or pharming code within the ad as well. I have captured code where this happened and Ebay denies it.

If you are looking for activity to decline you might as well forget it as it will not happen without a change in management and a hit on the financial markets.

How many transactions go through for fake goods?
Well ebay makes a commission from selling fake goods and it would be a very serious offset to cash flow if suddenly all the fake goods were removed from Ebay. If you live in la la land and dont believe the level of fake goods is over 75% for all good take a look at the lawsuits that can be readily found on the internet. These companies didnt sue Ebay because Ebay was helping to get the items off their site. Ebay always knows that given they have case law on their side that they simply go we are just an ISP business.

Ebay .... We are just an ISP business... This is in fact their legal stand on everything and anything that comes up. The dregs of society know this and it draws them to the site. What are the chances of getting caught from a company that has over 40000. claims to look at per year that are paid through insurance? The originating poster writes also about purchasing tvs and other types of consumer electronics. I know from personal experience of an extrordinary number of cases where the manufacturer does not want their items sold on Ebay. In fact if I sold items on Ebay from some of the manufacturers I deal with they would cut me off. Why do manufacturing companies not want their goods sold on Ebay?

Ebay and Porn... Take a look at the hard core porn being sold on Ebay. Kind of hard to figure when they just invited an attachment to a well known site of kids that are predominately under 18. I did a search and there was active over 20000 active items that would be considered HARD PORN. Now every corporation has a chance for management to make a decision whether they want to be involved at all in some industries. This involvement of being a player on the porn industry tells me a lot about the culture of management and their decision process for the long term.

Account security is a problem. Ebays response is on record that they could easily eliminate a big majority by installing some security measures. It refuses to do so because it may make some new people not come to the site and bid for the first time. A decision to not protect users from scum in order for some perceived short term cash flow.

In any event if you do by chance read the article about ebay and the lemon marketplace you will note that the cycle becomes almost a complete haven for transactions that instill a lack of trust. Good sellers leave ... More dregs come in .. prices come down .. sellers keep leaving for more profitable channels.. all thats left is a site for junk, fake goods, and fraud.

I strongly believe Ebay is at a high risk of being a target. If there was a reliable replacement for Ebay I would expect a quick exodus.

Ebay doesnt work in my eyes over the long term. Customer support is predominately equivalent to their stand that they are only an ISP provider. A host of boiler plate letters from non existent people. Fraud numbers up the wazoo. Very Very serious security breaches and this activity keeps going up not down. Take a search on Ebay Security vluduz. Embarassed

Take a look at the forums where censorship is the prevailing attribute. The trust of the feedback system as the measuring tool is totally ineffective and if you did a poll the vast majority of people would vote that the feedback system is not reliable. In fact recently I have gone on the community pages and the only promotion is that of feedback retaliation. Give it a go and see what I mean. You will see with a few searches that censorship is the management mandate for Ebay on the forums. You will see that the forums are being run with their mandate and the responses they want to hear and everything else is banned, or removed. You will see people all over sites like this that say they offered their opinion and were abused, insulted and it is the worst forum I have seen and it is allowed to proliferate.

For people to spend their time writing about such concerns they have to be passionate about the differences between right and wrong. I don't think it is one or two slight events that set people off to participate and give their time to devote to making people aware of their feelings. Hopefully someone that has some brains for the long term will steer Ebay in another direction. If they do not bring back better sellers they will lose the ones they have.
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As far as buying tvs and other like items that the originator stated, Its just not the risk of receiving the item. Even if you do get it what level of service are you going to get from the seller. What was the history of the plasma tv? How honest are sellers of this history? Is the seller an authorized dealer? Is the ebay seller going to give you any advise on how to tweak the product? Would you feel comfortable asking an Ebay seller for instance what the current settings of a plasma tv are out of the box and how do I adjust it. Plasma Tvs are set up to perform in a retail store environment. No TV is set up from the box store to perform properly in your home. Does an Ebay seller have training to tell you how to adjust this set?

mommyof4justtryingtomake$ · Just Registered Joined: 17 Feb 2008 Posts: 2

lets unite in the suspension forum for a change!
http://www.aspkin.com/forums/